Set forth below is the text of an e-mail that Mike Piper (author of the Oblivious Investor blog) sent me on October 28, 2009, in response to the e-mail that I sent to him that was set forth in yesterday’s blog entry.
Rob-
Sometimes two thinking, reasonable people can disagree about something. Surely you know this.
I haven’t been “ducking these questions.” I’ve been neglecting to respond to your comments for the same reason that I’m asking you to stop posting them: We already discussed/addressed your claims on your original guest post. And yet, we still disagree. I’ve seen the data you’re referencing, and yet I disagree as to how to respond to it.
I think we’re well past the point where further discussion of the topic is going to be beneficial. (And my readers’ emails tell me that they feel the same way.) And that is why I’m asking you to stop bringing it up on my blog.
That’s really all I have to say about this.
Thank you.
-Mike
I responded with an e-mail that stated: “I am going to continue to post honestly, Mike.”
I followed up shortly thereafter with an e-mail asking Mike if he objected to me posting the full texts of his e-mails at this blog. He responded by saying: “Feel free.”
Evidence Based Investing says
What the Trinity Study authors meant
I emailed one of the authors of the paper…
Rob, have you ever emailed any of the authors of the Trinity study?
Rob says
Thanks for that link, Evidence. That’s a huge help! I will also use that link at the “Today’s Passion” feature.
I have never e-mailed the authors of the Trinity study. It’s been on my “To Do” list for a long time.
I expect to be writing a Google Knol sometime within the next few months that will describe The Retirement Risk Evaluator. When I write that, I will e-mail them and let them know about the new tool.
Rob
Evidence Based Investing says
I have never e-mailed the authors of the Trinity study. It’s been on my “To Do” list for a long time.
So you have been waging an eight year campaign to have the SWR studies corrected and yet in that eight year time span you have not contacted the authors of the the most well known SWR study even once.
This demonstrates clearly that your campaign is not about SWRs at all but rather a personal vendetta against certain people who contribute at discussion boards from which you have been banned.
Rob says
My “campaign” is to have the Retire Early and Indexing boards (and the Personal Finance Blogosphere too) opened up to honest posting on SWRs and other important investment-related topics, Evidence. How the heck is anything that the Trinity authors say going to affect that?
We discovered that the Old School SWR studies were analytically invalid in May 2002. We have had numerous big-name experts confirm this in the time since. Did any of that cause Lindauer or Greaney to lift the ban on honest posting?
The problem today is that these people have engaged in so much dishonest posting that they are afraid to lift the ban on honest posting. There are obviously going to be thousands of lawsuits filed when people learn what has been done.
Is any of that my doing? I have been saying since the first day that the deception and intimindation posts were a bad idea. I put forward a post to the Motley Fool board urging Greaney’s removal on November 23, 2002.
I mean, come on!
Rob
Evidence Based Investing says
And just to confirm that it is a personal vendetta you launch into a diatribe against your two favorite targets Messrs. Lindauer and Greaney.
Rob says
If you own a copy of my book, please turn to the Acknowledgments page, Evidence. You will there see that the name “John Greaney” is the first listed.
It is partly because I am John’s friend that I have argued so forcefully and for so long that he should drop the Campaign of Terror against our board communities. It is beneath him. It is beneath all humans.
The rub is — we need your help, Evidence. Ever since I discovered the errors in John’s study, he doesn’t listen to me. He might listen to you.
It certainly couldn’t hurt to give it a try.
Rob
Evidence Based Investing says
Ever since I discovered the errors in John’s study, he doesn’t listen to me.
The errors in John’s study are also the errors in the Trinity study. The Trinity study is much better known.
You should email the authors of the Trinity study with the communities findings by close of business today and urge them to correct their study.
It’s a win/win/win/win/win with no possible downside for anyone concerned.
Rob says
Is there some reason why you cannot e-mail them, Evidence?
I think it would be great if you did.
If you do not, I will do so when enough time opens up for me to write the Google Knol on SWRs. It makes sense to me to send the e-mail to the Trinity authors in connection with that project.
I’ve e-mailed lots of other people over the years. I haven’t noticed you sending out too many e-mails re this matter.
Rob
Evidence Based Investing says
You have time for over 8,000 posts at the goon board and blogging every day about months old email chains but you don’t have time to put together one email to the authors of the best known SWR study.
That shows a very misplaced sense of priorities.
Rob says
You’re entitled to your opinion, Evidence.
95 percent of what is generated at the Goon Central board is pure garbage. You got me re that one.
But you know what? If there is some weakness in my case, the people who post at that board are [i]highly motivated[/i] to bring it to my attention. So I can learn from posting there. And I have indeed on occasion learned things from my posting experiences there. Thanks, Schroeder! Thanks, Drip Guy! Thanks, Evidence!
There’s value in sending an e-mail to the Trinity authors too. But I am not the type to send an e-mail of that sort without first spending some time thinking it through and thinking through how to put things and all that sort of thing. So I am going to take on that task when I have the time to do it right. I don’t today see it as an urgent priority.
I do see it as an urgent priority to open the boards and blogs to honest posting. Most of the people who post at the boards and blogs are friends of mine and the vast majority has expressed a desire that honest posting be permitted. So I put that high on my “To Do” list. People matter, Evidence.
My sincere take.
Rob
Evidence Based Investing says
I don’t today see it as an urgent priority.
So millions of busted retirements are not an urgent priority. That is not the story you have been telling for the past eight years.
Rob says
You’re being argumentative, Evidence.
Please stop.
Rob